[oldschool]

Not long ago made in Japan met poor quality and inexpensive products, today Japan is consider equal if not better than western European or American made products. Made in China has always met inexpensive knock off products.
About 30 years ago China started a plan to educate and industrialize their country to be equal or better than the western countries. Chinese students have studied, interned and apprenticed in every western country. Today china is building new schools, universities, hospitals, industrial manufacturing facilities at a rate of one city the size of Pittsburg every week. This is new infrastructure and made in China is becoming the worlds leading supplier of durable goods. The Chinese quality will equal anyones in the world within a decade. Sobering, it should be!
Enjoy made in America products and buy American made goods as long as you can to keep us competitive.
Made in Japan sounds almost friendly compared to made in China.
Tom

 

[imonembad]

That is just staggering stats. Its really scary to think about.

 

[Guest]

We only have ourselves to blame. I hate it but it is true. America is the only one that can undo what they have done......if their willing.

 

[OTTER]

The sad shame about all this is that the majority of consumers do not care any more Even if they did, it is almost impossible to find "real" made in America items in the majority of the retail stores. Even in grocery stores if you read the lables on canned fruits you will see that a lot of them are a product from Vietnam and elsewhere. I was in retail management for over 12 years and during that time I saw more and more foreign products and less and less American made. In fact, the company I worked for sold pro-American slogan t-shirts following 9/11---Made In China!! I did a slow burn every time we got a shipment in |!!| We have to first demand American products, then we have to be willing to pay the price. It is easy to do the first, but the majority are not willing to pay more. I too admitt my guilt. To turn it around now would take strong congressional action, and the lobbiest from other countries have the control. By the way, if you can, do not use Citgo gas and oil products. A certian Latin American dictator, who has openly called for the fall of the United States at the U.N., controls Citgo. OK,OK, I'll get off my soap box---Sorry.

Gary

 

[Jared]

I dont know all the details but I did hear something about China not following fair trade procedures. Something about them skimming money off the top somewhere so we can't compete and they end up with extra money for their military. All I do know is that it has many politicians fit to be tied.

Personally I DESPISE how american companies use foreign workers in other countries to handle their business whether it be tech/customer support or manufacturing. I think a hefty tax should be placed on companies that do that to perhaps make them change their ways and give an american the job.

Blech! makes me sick to think about it.

 

[Guest]

Lobyists no doubt pay our good old politicians to keep them at bay from passing such laws that would impose sanctions on overseas importation of goods or services. It makes me ill also to see a Communist country like China prosper because we all want to get rich.

The problem lies in American's belief system. You see lots of Americans want to make lots of money themselves (IE They charge allot of money for their products, service, time etc.) Yet they do not want to PAY allot of money for anyone else's products, services, time etc. So the answer? Get China or other third world countries who pay their citizens a few bucks a day to do the same thing that we would make $20 an hour doing. The end result is the product that we buy is cheap for us yet we still mark it up because remember we want to sell our products for top dollar.

Untill this changes we will always find cheap labor that will benefit those countries governments and hurt our own. Notice this is not helping the peasants who are doing the labor but it is in fact helping the governemnts! China has expressed hatred for America more then once and is a Nuclear capable country. It bothers me that we are assisting them financially so that one day they might have the resources to attack us. Way to go big business and consumerism.

BTW, I never will buy gas from Citgo even if I have to push my truck to the next gas station. Chavez can kiss my butt if he thinks he will see a dime of my money.

 

[hi steel basser]

:bowdown: Keith, you jst saved me a whole lot of typing. I can sum it up with a quote: "The love of money is the root of all evil." I read that Somewhere. :usa:

 

[georgemro]

I have news for you all, it's too late to turn things around. Tom is 100% correct with his info. I have a close friend who owns a company that builds machines for the steel industry and China is one of their largest customers. He travels their quite often. He said the building of infrastructure is incredible. They have the largest airport in the world,the largest steel mill , magnificent commercial buildings and 6 lane highways going everywhere and very few people have cars because they can't afford them yet. An American steel worker's wage & benefit package is near $60/hr. and the Chinese is $12/hr. If you payed attention the first Chinese car was introduced in America last year and soon will be on the market here . My friend said it is depressing to him when he goes their because they are preparing to take over the industrialized world and he is convinced that they will, sooner rather than later. We have created our own destiny. I live near the city of Pittsburgh , PA.(STEEL TOWN USA)and the parking lots of the mills that remain are full of foreign cars driven the employees of these mills.Even in the fishing industry many of our lures are made in China and third world countries. Enough of the political B.S.let's go fishing. Man,those Luckycrafts do sound friendly.

 

[OTTER]

I am the eternal optimist. Somewhere in the Beaver Clever world I grew up in, I was taught that you can change things, if you want to. It will take trade barriers,
a strong recession, tough legislation and honest political leadership to get it done. At no point did I use the word easy. America has given away world leadership in production and manufaturing, we are rapidly giving away our technlogical leadership. The bottom line is that if we continue to surrender our position as a world leader, then within another 100 years, we will be considered a "third world" country. I will not be concerned about these things while I am on the lake fishing with my foreign made rods, reels and tackle but the next day, when I read about another plant closing or another major layoff, or I have to call a computer help desk and I can't understand the other person on the other end of the phone, I will be angry and I will be reminded of what we have given away. I will now climb off my soap box and will get back to the subject at hand, FISHING!

8) 8)

 

[oldschool]

The reason this was posted was to point out that China no longer is the cottage labor source for inexpensive assembly of products. The fishing industry started sending rod blanks to China over 25 years ago to have the rods wrapped, reel seat and handles assembled. Fenwick was one of the early companies to do this. Before long the Chinese were making the blanks and building the rods complete. Today only a few American rods are actually made in America, over 90% are made in China, including G. Loomis. Reels followed, the machining first went to Korea and assembly in China, now China manufactures over 90% of the reels, including Abu Garcia. Every major industry is experiencing the same cycle, for example over 90% of the fine wood furniture with American names are made in China, the list is endless. China does not belong to any world industry organization. For example patents, China is not a member and does not recognize patent law, so no patent protection enforced or liability for infringement.
It is hard to boycot fishing tackle made in China because so many name brands that we know and trust are made their now. However you can still find made in America products, it takes a little research to locate them and then buy them.

Tom

 

[Guest]

Agreed Tom.

China is benefiting because when we send products over there for them to build then in effect we are teaching them how to make whatever product they are assembling. So they have no Research and development costs like our companies here in America have. China just takes what we send them and starts to build them. This is what Japan did also and look at what they have achieved?

Maybe we can start a made in America thread and post products that are wholly made in America including all the parts? This way we can keep a running tally of things made in America so we can have a chance at considering those options before buying Chinese made ones.

 

[OTTER]

Great idea Keith. At least we would have a direction to turn. Ahhh, the clearer heads in the group prevail!

 

[oldschool]

Good Idea, will look into it. Okuma of China is the largest reel manufacturer in the world today and makes nearly all the discount house brands, BPS, Cabelas, Shakespear, Browning, Abu Garcia and Quantum.
Tom

 

[GotstaFish]

GotstaFish Tackle is, and always will be made in the USA!!!

 

[Oldfart9999]

For those who watch NASCAR, only 1 of the cars is made in this country, the Toyota. We are at a point were things move & change pretty quickly in this world. In this country we are our biggest enemies, we want all kinds of services but we won't pay the price for them. When we tax buisness, big or small they don't pay the tax, we do, it is passed on raising the price. We have relatively low unenployment, & decent wages now but will this hold for the future? Our kids are not studying math or science, they are studying buisness, where is the brain trust going to be for new products in 10 years? Citgo does not own the dealers who sell it in this country, they are owned by Americans who got caught up in international politics by a lowlife creep, now the dealers are suffering. I guess my point is that the problem is not with products made elsewhere but with the question of how do we become competitive with these other nations.
rodney

 

[Hawghunter]

What a difficult topic to discuss, much less understand. My disclaimer is that I am a homer and tilt toward domestic products - when the quality and economy of those products are equal to others on the market. I refuse to support inferior products simply because they are domestically produced. I also will make political choices in my consumption such as avoiding Citgo and like products whose profit support the destruction of our society. However, the international marketplace is far more complicated than just avoiding foreign-made products.

Which do you buy? Belgium chocolate or American chocolate? Godiva is a commercial-grade chocolate made in Belgium but is owned by Campbell's Soup (or at least it used to be). Ethel M is a higer-grade chocolate made in Henderson, NV by American labor and is owned by Mars, Incorporated, an American-based company. Both companies are multi-national and have markets around the world. The cocoa used in both products comes largely from Ivory Coast in Africa. The sugar in Ethel M is largely American-produced and costs more than the sugar used by Godiva as a result of domestic protectionist laws favoring American sugar producers (who by the way are largely foreign-owned corporations). Milk in both markets is price-supported by each government to ensure domestic supply and to appease the agriculture lobby.

So if you buy the Ethel M made by an "American" company, are you supporting them so they have more capability to produce M&Ms in China? Asia is one of their fastest-growing markets and those M&M are making millions of Chinese kids happy every day.

I purchased a new Lamiglas rod recently as a result of taking Tom's advice on it and I can't be happier with my purchase. American-made by American labor. But, what if the price/quality ratio was such that the equally superior rod was made by Shimano in China? Do I then tax myself to buy the same quality rod for twice the money? That is one difficult choice, eh?

Economics is dismal and certainly not simple. FWIW, China is one of the major purchasers of US Bonds. Cut the current purchase of bonds in half by China and Japan, and your interest rates soar. So, whose market is it anyway?

 

[Guest]

Good points HH.

 

[oldschool]

Bumped this up to update the topic.
Traveling across the country the other day I had the opportunity to sit next to a director of ICE on the flight home. We got into a conversation about the cost of counterfit products, ICE's largest budget item by far.
It appears the made in China has come full circle where the Chinese government is losing tax and tariff money due to counterfit products being produced by Chinese manufactures. The problem is tremendous over 1/2 of the products made in China are being counterfitted and shipped everywhere.
Nothing is spared, even counterfit drinking water.
The rods and reels you think are Abu Garcia or almost every brand made in China are more then likely counterfit, low quality knock offs made in the same factory as the so called original brand.
Tom

 

[LuckyBassTurd]

wow , thats a old thread....
good to know!
I notice U.S. companies doing the same thing during the holidays, you want that good American quality product for your self or a friend lets say a "gerber multi tool'... you find one at walmart for a cheap $10, made in china? the one i bought 5 years prior almost the same but made in the USA was over $45.... trick me once shame on you, trick me twice ....never :cussin:!
if the price for shippment on incoming goods rose up with a huge import tax to offset the polution of shipping, then USA made could be comparable in price? but we seem to not charge for the pollution we inherit from the cheap goods, as long as we get the products we think we need NOW! we will pay later for those supossed needs, like the bamboo steamer, magic 8ball, and rubics cube, we gotta have it, if it's cheap, but add $5 or $10 dollars to those cheap products and half of us wouldn't buy them till they go on sale anyway....



but then again when i think USA made i think of sweat shops full of illegals ?

 

[oldschool]

The problem today isn't so much as the cheap Chinese discount brand that sells for penny's on the dollar, it's the high end brand being counterfitted and sold as the original. Lets say you buy a Daiwa Steez casting reel for $520 and it breaks. You send it back to Daiwa for repairs and learn it's a counterfit reel. Daiwa, the dealer and you are all have a problem.
Made in USA or anywhere else doesn't exempt the product from having counterfit parts. Every product is affected or infected by counterfits.
Very scary.
Tom